Congress in Fantasy Land....

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WoVeU
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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby WoVeU » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:59 am

Eric wrote:I think the federal government is allowed to dictate certain things to the states via the supremacy clause. However, I agree that the federal government should do what the Constitution says it should. The thing here is that the 10th amendment clearly states that the powers not granted to the federal government are supposed to be monitored at the state level. This is definitely not happening :evil:

I think the whole deal with state's rights is partially affected by how our mindset has evolved as Americans. As it became easier to communicate and stay connected with people on the other side of the country, I think we all started thinking in a national mindset instead of a state mindset. Civil rights was the nail in the coffin for state's rights. I'm by NO MEANS making excuses for segregation and I think the Civil Rights Act was necessary, just to clarify. My only point is that Americans felt the need to make every law from the national level instead of the local level. We need an amendment protecting marriage! We need to have the Supreme Court dictate that abortions are legal everywhere! We need to set up national social insurance programs! We need national academic standards! And so on and so forth.


I believe that is correct. We have attempted to do everything under a national umbrella for about 70 years. I think it would all work so much better if you unloaded the federal level and let the states control virtually anything that looks to get anything less tan 66% support of a particular approach at the national level. States will address the issue, review the independent fixes in 20 years and then adopt a national program/law/whatever that is swayed in the direction of those that have demonstrated prudence. Not a total adoption but something that structures a skeleton nationally. This, perceivably, would keep the states "United" and moreover stop much political grandstanding and spinning of the wheels for decades. Further, oversight and measurable results and parameters would reside much closer to home!

The worst Engineers I see are those that beat the dead horse...continuing to try and tweak a system or component into an acceptable form after they had conceived it to be the best solution. "One more time around the mountain!" And the second worst Engineers, design things thinking of many hows and whats...never stopping to think if it is needed or justified at all! Each of these are standard practice in government! If a Scientist, Engineer, Accountant, or Doctor did this as a constant practice...he would be out of the practice with a quickness. But we have lawyers on the Hill...lawyers are good at running their upper holes and acting like the lower ones and make a living out of circle talk, often the better ones make a living out of discounting proof, science, and even common sense. Now the day they earn the title of Representative, or Governor, or so on...is this practice supposed to magically stop. I've watched mankind a good while, it isn't true that men don't change. Opinions and other things sometimes change with people...but the broad stroke of how they do things is very much a rarity!
Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.
If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby Spence » Wed Aug 19, 2009 12:05 pm

donovan wrote:The states will get back their constitutional provisions when Boise goes to the National Championship....


Boise will go long before the states get their constitutional power I am afraid.
"History doesn't always repeat itself but it often rhymes." - Mark Twain

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby WoVeU » Wed Aug 19, 2009 1:55 pm

Spence wrote:
donovan wrote:The states will get back their constitutional provisions when Boise goes to the National Championship....


Boise will go long before the states get their constitutional power I am afraid.



They'll 3-peat first!!! Football, Basketball, and Baseball! Hawaii will play all home games. And the Buckeyes will change their name to the Southern Wolverines!
Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.
If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
R. Reagan

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby Derek » Wed Aug 19, 2009 5:00 pm

The government is bad IMO. Jefferson called it a "necessary evil"...in other words...it's Evil and not to be trusted.

Tort reform will go farther than ALL other "fixes" you implement.

When doctors don't have to pay $100K plus for malpractice insurance (and yes it does happen), then the costs will not go down.

The answer is not more government, never has been, never will be...no matter the circumstances you might dream up in discussion.
They’re either going to run the ball here or their going to pass it.

The fewer rules a coach has, the fewer rules there are for players to break.

See, well ya see, the thing is, he should have caught that ball. But the ball is bigger than his hands.

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby billybud » Wed Aug 19, 2009 7:26 pm

State's rights died at Fort Sumter.
“If short hair and good manners won football games, Army and Navy would play for the national championship every year.”

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby donovan » Wed Aug 19, 2009 8:09 pm

billybud wrote:State's rights died at Fort Sumter.



Dang...I hate when I miss the wakes...
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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby Spence » Wed Aug 19, 2009 9:14 pm

billybud wrote:State's rights died at Fort Sumter.



I thought that was the battle to preserve the states. I think State's rights died March 4, 1933.
"History doesn't always repeat itself but it often rhymes." - Mark Twain

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby WoVeU » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:39 pm

donovan wrote:
billybud wrote:State's rights died at Fort Sumter.



Dang...I hate when I miss the wakes...



Hahhhhhh! You have to keep that black suit on the ready! We can kill a good thing in the blink of an eye now-a-days!
Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.
If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
R. Reagan

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WoVeU
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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby WoVeU » Wed Aug 19, 2009 10:40 pm

Spence wrote:
billybud wrote:State's rights died at Fort Sumter.



I thought that was the battle to preserve the states. I think State's rights died March 4, 1933.



While the day doesn't stick in my head...I know that year!

Yes sir, ditto!
Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves.
If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
R. Reagan

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby Derek » Fri Aug 21, 2009 12:54 pm

Spence wrote:
billybud wrote:State's rights died at Fort Sumter.



I thought that was the battle to preserve the states. I think State's rights died March 4, 1933.



I'd say 1913 with the power to tax income. There all valid viewpoints.
They’re either going to run the ball here or their going to pass it.

The fewer rules a coach has, the fewer rules there are for players to break.

See, well ya see, the thing is, he should have caught that ball. But the ball is bigger than his hands.

- John Madden

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Spence
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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby Spence » Fri Aug 21, 2009 5:17 pm

I don't like the income tax; I agree that was a trigger for big government. With taxes, I would rather see a sales tax cover everything. While I don't believe it can be a flat amount, because food, clothing, and shelter would need to be a lower amount then everything else - I believe it would be a more fair system. The States should get all of the money from the tax and they should decide the percentages (beholden to the people) and then pay the federal government an amount to keep it running. The federal government should be in the business of defense and upholding the constitution. The States should do the rest.

We the people should be in charge of charity. We do a better job now then the government and we haven't scratched the surface of what we are capable of. The more the government takes over taking care of those who can’t take care of themselves, the more jaded the people become of the problems. The people can and would do a much better job.
"History doesn't always repeat itself but it often rhymes." - Mark Twain

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Re: Congress in Fantasy Land....

Postby Derek » Sun Aug 23, 2009 9:07 pm

Yep
They’re either going to run the ball here or their going to pass it.

The fewer rules a coach has, the fewer rules there are for players to break.

See, well ya see, the thing is, he should have caught that ball. But the ball is bigger than his hands.

- John Madden


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