NSA Wiretappings

[Spence]

Reasonable people can argue for eternity what measures do and don't violate our rights. We don't have eternity to figure out what's "proper" for everyone to agree with.

At this point, I don't see evidence that rights are being violated. The NSA wiretaps are targeting suspects believed to have terrorist links. Every measure should be taken to intercept terrorist communications, financial transactions, etc.

But in the end, I want all reasonable measures taken to reduce or eliminate the threat in the quickest possible time frame. I don't want my kids to have to take care of this mess, or pay the price for it, just because my generation didn't have the guts to do it thoroughly.

I totally agree we should take care of it now. Before these people get any stronger. I'm not even against the CIA or FBI doing this covertly. I just don't want it to be a matter of law. It is semantics, I know, but laws can come back and haunt us.

What many people don't understand about this war is that these people want us eliminated from the planet. They want our women, children, and us gone from the face of the earth. We have to stop them before they have the power to give it a shot. Russia, China, and a lot of Europe don't think it is a huge deal because they don't much like us either. That is a very short sighted view because they want them gone too, we are just todays target of their hatred. This is going to get a lot worse before it gets better and leaders from both sides of congress better realize it. The problem is that most people alive today do not remember what it was like to fight against someone with global domination in mind. Our baby boom society(of which I am a part) had better read a little pre 1950's history. Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it. The threat these people pose to our way of life is real.

[mountainman]

Well said, Spence ...... the issue is the terrorist not the telephones.


It's very confusing to me that, based on what we've all seen that many folks seem to not believe the threat is real.

I'm amazed that knowing the destructive potential of a nuclear weapon, biological weapon, chemical weapon together with the freedom to come and go and travel from one point to another, along with the vastness of the borders, the seaports and the airways of this country, that folks would be so easily persuaded or conclude themselves that the potential and risk are not very real.

I heard testimony today, from the trial of Sadaam Hussian, where 50,000 to 100,000 Kurds were killed by chemical weapons. It is not my intent to even attempt to change anybody's mind, but I would hope that some folks would take into consideration what has indeed happened in this nation and other nations and ask themselves the question:

What are the potential consequences and what are the potential risks of those consequences if the terrorist are not stopped?

[Spence]

The consequences are very real. There are 3 billion muslims. People seem to think that this one little country isn't a threat. We aren't fighting a country, we are fighting an ideology. This is the biggest threat that we have faced since Hitler. We almost waited too long to get into that fight. We can't afford to let this one go that long.

[openSkies]

Liberals have complained and complained that Bush never listens to the American people...

Well, seems he's been doing it all along!

//

Seriously, I have no problem. Let the CIA, FBI, NSA, NTSB, FAA, CDC, and all those other acronyms monitor my calls. Doesn't bother me a bit.

Put a camera on my street corner. Please. Catch all the people who run the stop sign and come close to taking out a group of kids on bikes.

Watch my bank transactions. Just don't tell mom and dad about that $300 charge to the local xxx shop.

As long as you have a set goal in mind, such as fighting a war on terror, I say do all the surveillance you can. Don't listen in without a good reason and then bust me because I told my friend I'd burn him a copy of the new CD I got last night, but by all means, take me to Gitmo when I talk about financing a plot to blow up the White House.

Reasonable suspicion is enough for me to feel comfortable with the monitoring of activities.

PS - Top section of this post comes from Capitol Steps' lastest album. Funny CD, you all should check it out.

[mountainman]

No political motives or political party adgenda support here ... my motive is simply the welfare of the country and the nation. Kind of like fanatic put it, I don't want to leave future generations with a mess. Those generations had nothing to do with it, did not in any way contribute to or cause it.

I am pleased and support our government being pro-active.

There was a re-assuring incident, in my view anyway, that happened in the last week or so that our government is being pro-active ...... there was a flight coming from somewhere in the northeast, Boston maybe, and a woman passenger was causing a ruckus during the flight. The incident was reported by the pilot and a couple of F-16's were scrambled to intercept the flight. As it turned out the woman reportedly had an attack of claustrophobia and there was no real threat ......

.....now, stop and think about that. Those two F-16's could not do anything about what was going on inside that passenger airliner. They are fighter aircraft build, designed, manned and armed to destroy targets that pose a threat ...... and it didn't take much to get them up and ready to do just that.

[Derek]

What amazes me is that people think there "rights" are being violated in this situation..NEVER MIND the fact that the numbers that were tagged to be tapped were taken from a captured AL-Kyduuhhh leader's cell phone...

OH!!! And by ALL means let's not forgot the freakin patriots at the New York Times!!!

HOW NOBLE of them to expose this and the financial monitoring of these KNOWN terrorist groups and their members.

EVERY time I think about this, and how people get so worked up over something like this, well.....it just makes my eyes bleed!!!!

Off my soapbox...

[mountainman]

Bottom line....

Thank the terrorists and the large scale drug dealers for this. That is what brought this about.

Understood, BlackpowderEER.

Looks like some people have forgotten and disregarded the constitution, and the declaration of independence for that matter.

I am hopeful that's not the case, rolltide. Here's some of my considerations that were part of my effort while deciding which side of the issue I was going to come down on. There are others, but these are the constitutional questions I considered:

Amendment 1 - Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Amendment 4 - The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seisures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment 9 - The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment 10 - The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

As for The Declaration Of Independence .... not intended to be taken out of context, but simply to apply the same or similar reasoning.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

I believe that both of the two groups, mentioned by BlackpowderEER, have intentions that will bring one or more of the rights mentioned into jeopardy. These groups are using the rights we enjoy as a nation as a way to satisfy their own motivations and to impose their will upon others in a harmful way.

Well, for what it's worth, those are some of my thoughts and considerations.