Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Say it all here
Forum rules
NOTICE: Please be sure to check the and the page before posting.
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable
User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10279
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:51 am
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Eric » Tue Nov 17, 2020 8:09 pm

It's been about 2 years since my last stop by the forum, so I am interested to get caught up with everybody! But I'm here to repeat my common refrain about Michigan football!

Even in this semi-meaningless pandemic-stricken season, we were hoping that the product wouldn't be this bad. Harbaugh is a zombie on the sidelines, a shell of his former self. He either got fat and lazy from getting a mega contract, or he might be suffering from CTE (which is not something I want to make light about, but this "source" is a guy I know who knows a guy). Regardless I do not think he is fit for the job and hasn't been since the 2018 loss at Ohio State.

In 2015, I wasn't overly-happy, but I suspended any doubts I had about the trajectory knowing that it would be a building year; I saw some flaws, but left open the possibility that I would be very very wrong. 2016, those same flaws continued, but I couldn't argue with the W/L record and NFL-caliber players. 2017 was when it really hit the fan with injuries and horrendous QB play; I complained a lot but also knew in the back of my head that it had the potential to be a lost season as most of the new starters would have been guys who Michigan settled for in the 2015 recruiting dead period between coaching changes. 2018, again I saw serious issues and a down B1G, but it was another shot for Harbaugh to get over the hump. 2019 saw the ridiculous haphazard hire of Josh Gattis when there were 40 other coordinators out there in the country with a proven, unassailable track record that he should have gotten instead and it cost us an entire year of player development. Now, the crap we're seeing in 2020 where guys don't even want to play for this man.

Harbaugh's biggest structural problems:

- Lack of QB development. Rudock -> Speight -> Peters -> Patterson -> Milton. Michigan's QB play has been dreadful, and honestly some of the worst sustained QB play at a major college football powerhouse since 2015. Give me a blueblood who has been worse during that span. Maybe Tennessee or Miami.

- Gameplanning. From 15-18 it was the offense that wouldn't modernize. Since 2018 in their matchups against elite offenses, the defense gets completely shredded. Harbaugh's staff is one of the worst at making halftime adjustments in the NCAA.

- Recruiting. Michigan has been getting a lot of low-hanging fruit from the Northeast. Maybe it's a negative stereotype, but the Northeast has a reputation for producing soft football players and there is certainly not a very large football culture out there. Recruiting services tend to inflate the pedigree of guys if blue blood start chasing them, but the problem is Michigan and Penn State are oftentimes the only schools making a hard push to get these guys. You don't see Clemson, A&M, Georgia, Bama, USC, Ohio State, or Oklahoma really go hard for them. Worse yet, Michigan "casts a wide net" and tries to figure out the details later. Harbaugh is not invested in finding guys who fit a scheme or have personality types. He is picking up whoever he can find and arrogantly thinking he can mold a well-rounded football team out of whoever he gets. Lloyd Carr's path to stocking his rosters full of NFL-caliber potential was cutting into Ohio. Michigan has for all intents and purposes abandoned Ohio recruiting, which is also where you find guys who have a chip on their shoulders against the Buckeyes. No wonder we have lost that edge in that "rivalry" game. Now Ohio guys who don't end up at OSU are going to MSU, Cincinnati, Kentucky, Notre Dame, and Penn State, or sometimes even the other SEC schools. Michigan needs a slice of that action in order to get better.

- Pushing people away. Many of his best recruits and players either leave the team or transfer out, leaving the cupboard bare in the process. They either don't like his style, don't like him, or feel they're not getting their due with playing time. We had a top 10 receiving unit in America in 2018 in terms of skill and potential, and it was left untapped because we couldn't open up the offense. Peoples-Jones left for the pros because he said Michigan was hurting his draft stock, Black is playing for Texas, and Collins sat this year out. Ambry Thomas quit on the team. Aubrey Soloman left to Tennessee. Duwumfor went to Rutgers (plays Michigan next week). It's a terrible look. McCaffery, who would be better than Milton if given playing time, left the team.


Bottom line is Michigan needs a change and Harbaugh needs a change of scenery (provided that rumor isn't true, otherwise he should focus on staying healthy). Harbaugh would be better off for a short stint in the NFL. My favorite candidates to replace Harbaugh: Meyer, Petersen, Stoops, Whittingham, Campbell, Fickell, Joe Brady, Jeff Hafley, Gary Patterson, Billy Napier, Pat Fitzgerald. Any one of them could do better or at least equal Harbaugh's tenure. The reason being, outside of a decent winning %, Harbaugh has brought zero division titles, one semi-important bowl victory, zero playoff appearances, zero Heismans, one practice squad NFL QB, a .500 record against Michigan State, and zero victories against Ohio State in 6 years.

Anyway, it was fun venting about Michigan football one more time here! How has this year been treating you guys? :mrgreen:
Running bowl/MSU/OSU record '05-present: 11-32

User avatar
Spence
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 20167
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 11:52 pm
Location: Chillicothe, Ohio (Ohio's First Capital)
Contact:

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Spence » Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:16 pm

Nice to see you back roaming the halls. I think you right. I don't really know what what is wrong with Michigan, but the current version is the worst I have ever seen. I do think the lack of solid QB play is probably the most glaring issue. I think Milton was thrown out too soon and not ready. It couldn't do much for his confidence. I don't believe that the offense is the biggest issue, though, I think Don Brown's failure to admit his defensive schemes are out dated is Michigan's biggest issue the last several years.

I think you are dead on about recruiting Ohio. When Tressel was hired he built a fence around Ohio. Even helped steer players he didn't want to Dantonio's Michigan State teams. Lots of players in Michigan football's hall of fame were from Ohio. It doesn't happen anymore. Players that Ohio State wants and doesn't get go to Clemson, Alabama, or somewhere like that now. Occasionally Ohio State will lose one to Penn State. Almost never to Michigan anymore. I can't remember the last time Ohio State wanted an Ohio kid that Michigan ended up getting, maybe Jake Butt. No one the caliber of Woodson, Grbec, or Howard. Recruiting is the lifeblood of any college football team. Recruiting is as important as player development in CFB.

Honestly I hope to see Michigan right the ship. I think Michigan being good makes the conference and Ohio State better. Eventually they will right the ship, but they have made a series of bad moves that will take a while to fix. Michigan wasn't more talented than Ohio State going clear back into the 80's. But they always had a great QB and a coach that could exploit Ohio State's weaknesses and playing the last game of the season, those weaknesses were all out there. They never lost site of who was the biggest rival in the conference. They got away from that when Carr left and Harbaugh doesn't seem to be able to capture it.

I hope you hang out a more often. You are one of the most knowledgeable people I have known on subject of CFB. You always seem to know about coaches and players before they come out of obscurity and we notice them.
"History doesn't always repeat itself but it often rhymes." - Mark Twain

User avatar
Mountainman
Head Coach
Head Coach
Posts: 1303
Joined: Sun Aug 26, 2018 9:42 am
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Mountainman » Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:05 am

Hey Eric....... its been a while. Good to hear from you and get your insight and perspective on the goings on. I agree, Harbaugh is toast. Read just today were he said he’s going to ‘examine the program from top to bottom and find out what’s wrong and fix it’. Too late coach, guys in your position are paid big bucks to stay in front of things before they get out of whack, not ‘fix’ what’s out of whack that occurred on and during YOUR watch.

As a Mountaineer Fan growing up there were three games one never missed...... West Virginia and Pitt (The Backyard Brawl), West Virginia and Penn State (The Annual Ass-Kicking) and (Ohio State and Michigan). The BigTen is better when the Wolverines are a top level program. 8)
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.

User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10279
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:51 am
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Eric » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:12 am

Running bowl/MSU/OSU record '05-present: 11-32

User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10279
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:51 am
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Eric » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:12 am

Running bowl/MSU/OSU record '05-present: 11-32

User avatar
Cane from the Bend
Athletic Director
Athletic Director
Posts: 4205
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:25 am
Location: South Bend, IN (domerville usa)
Contact:

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Cane from the Bend » Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:31 am

Cane... [__]

"It is only impossible until it has been accomplished." ... then it becomes standardized ...

Success is measured by results; whereas Character is measured through the means by which one achieves those results . . .

It seems the Rapture did come for two worthy souls:
In Memory of Grandpa Howdy
In Memory of Donovan Davisson

billybud
Athletic Director
Athletic Director
Posts: 10558
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2006 12:25 pm
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby billybud » Wed Nov 18, 2020 10:10 am

If he would just beat the Buckeyes....he might have lasted.
“If short hair and good manners won football games, Army and Navy would play for the national championship every year.”

User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10279
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:51 am
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Eric » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:06 pm

Running bowl/MSU/OSU record '05-present: 11-32

User avatar
Eric
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 10279
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:51 am
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Eric » Wed Nov 18, 2020 2:08 pm

Running bowl/MSU/OSU record '05-present: 11-32

User avatar
Cane from the Bend
Athletic Director
Athletic Director
Posts: 4205
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 1:25 am
Location: South Bend, IN (domerville usa)
Contact:

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Cane from the Bend » Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:01 pm

Cane... [__]

"It is only impossible until it has been accomplished." ... then it becomes standardized ...

Success is measured by results; whereas Character is measured through the means by which one achieves those results . . .

It seems the Rapture did come for two worthy souls:
In Memory of Grandpa Howdy
In Memory of Donovan Davisson

User avatar
Spence
Administrator
Administrator
Posts: 20167
Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 11:52 pm
Location: Chillicothe, Ohio (Ohio's First Capital)
Contact:

Re: Stick a Fork in Harbaugh

Postby Spence » Wed Nov 18, 2020 8:56 pm

"History doesn't always repeat itself but it often rhymes." - Mark Twain


[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable
[phpBB Debug] PHP Warning: in file [ROOT]/vendor/twig/twig/lib/Twig/Extension/Core.php on line 1266: count(): Parameter must be an array or an object that implements Countable

Return to “General Discussion”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 18 guests