Congrats to LSU

[Eric]

But when you lose 12 games and get shutout by Richmond, there is some consistency there.

I was talking about what Billybud said. I think Oklahoma was the best in the conference in 2003. Kansas State killed them in the championship game, but OU, over the course of the season, was probably better. "Best" and "better" are synonomous. K-State was the champ, but OU was likely better.

[billybud]

Lubbock...no...I don't do the "transitive thing"...you took that out of context and ran with it..

In the context of the Big 12..2003
It was clear that KSU was the best team in the B-12...they went undefeated in the North and beat the South Champion (who smeared the other south contenders)...my point was that, despite Spence's opinion, KSU won it on the field..by being better than the South Champion.

You can always make excuses...but Oklahoma was beaten in the title game and there was no reason to second guess KSU's status as the best of the Big 12 that year.

If KSU had snuck into the championship game with a lousy record and Oklahoma had a bunch of players out, there might be some cause...that wasn't the case.

While it is true that KSU lost three to Southern teams, they beat Oklahoma by 28 points...

[Eric]

Here's K-State's resume:

W
08-23-2003
42
California
28
BCA Classic


W
08-30-2003
41
Troy St. (AL)
5
Manhattan, KS


W
09-06-2003
55
McNeese St. (LA)
14
Manhattan, KS


W
09-13-2003
38
Massachusetts
7
Manhattan, KS


L
09-20-2003
20
Marshall (WV)
27
Manhattan, KS


L
10-04-2003
20
Texas
24
Austin, TX


L
10-11-2003
34
Oklahoma St.
38
Stillwater, OK


W
10-18-2003
49
Colorado
20
Manhattan, KS


W
10-25-2003
42
Kansas
6
Manhattan, KS


W
11-01-2003
38
Baylor (TX)
10
Manhattan, KS


W
11-08-2003
45
Iowa St.
0
Ames, IA


W
11-15-2003
38
Nebraska
9
Lincoln, NE


W
11-22-2003
24
Missouri
14
Manhattan, KS


W
12-06-2003
35
Oklahoma
7
Big 12 Championship Game


L
01-02-2004
28
Ohio St.
35
Fiesta Bowl


And Oklahoma's:

W
08-30-2003
37
North Texas
3
Norman, OK


W
09-06-2003
20
Alabama
13
Tuscaloosa, AL


W
09-13-2003
52
Fresno St. (CA)
28
Norman, OK


W
09-20-2003
59
UCLA
24
Norman, OK


W
10-04-2003
53
Iowa St.
7
Ames, IA


W
10-11-2003
65
Texas
13
Dallas, TX


W
10-18-2003
34
Missouri
13
Norman, OK


W
10-25-2003
34
Colorado
20
Boulder, CO


W
11-01-2003
52
Oklahoma St.
9
Norman, OK


W
11-08-2003
77
Texas A&M
0
Norman, OK


W
11-15-2003
41
Baylor (TX)
3
Norman, OK


W
11-22-2003
56
Texas Tech
25
Lubbock, TX


L
12-06-2003
7
Kansas St.
35
Big 12 Championship Game


L
01-04-2004
14
Louisiana St.
21
Sugar Bowl


Now you tell me which preformance was better.

[billybud]

Eric...they beat Oklahoma by 28 points...28 points

[Dossenator]

Florida beat LSU....Auburn beat both Florida and LSU. LSU FINISHED 4th IN THE SEC..........I can't believe this. If LSU gets a BCS bowl game the system is a joke. So Ark, LSU, and Auburn all finished with the same record. Well they are all 10-2....ARk finished 7-1 in SEC conference play and LSU and Auburn finished 6-2 in conference play. Again Auburn beat LSU. If Ark wins the SECCG how can LSU be picked above Flo...Florida beat LSU...and Florida would still have more wins.

Eric...You say the best team does not always win...that is true and I totally agree...but at the end of the day it does matter if you win or lose, and LSU lost 2 games in the conference....

Well, if LSU is deserving for a BCS game finishing fourth in their conference and 3rd in the SEC west then I think Viriginia Tech deserves a BCS game...they finished third in the ACC and don't get to play in their conference championship game....or how about Texas...they finished 3rd in the Big XII and do not get to play in their conference championship game...well they deserve a BCS game....remember the best team does not always win. How about the Big East...well not only will the 3rd place team not get mentioned but the 2nd place team has no shot at a BCS game....Louisville can finish with only 1 loss and have the same record as Rutgers and not make it into a BCS game. It is completely ludicrous to even be mentioning LSU and a BCS bowl in the same breath. They did not prove it on the field.

[billybud]

If Oklahoma wasn't feakin' killed by KSU...I might be able to say that Oklahoma was better.

Texas was beaten by Oklahoma by a gazillion (50+)...A&M was beaten by Oklahoma by a gazillion (77-0)..

But KSU just whipped the doggy doo out of the Sooners that day...when you beat them by four touchdowns, there isn't much doubt.

[billybud]

Did I ever deny that K-State was the better team that particular day/year? No...

You responded to a post where I was discussing with Spence and Eric...KSU and 2003.

[Spence]

I brought K-State-Oklahoma into the argument. I got lots or responses, so it worked.

[billybud]

This conversation begs the question...Is South Florida "better" than WVUY?

Well, we all know that sometimes 21 point underdogs win the game...but are they better than the team that they upset?

Most would say "no"...but, in that particular game they were. I do understand that we are attacking both ends of this conversation. If they had a rematch, I'd still put money on WVU (but not as much, LOL),

[billybud]

Me? I like this transitive thing when it works my way..LOL...such as Fla over LSU 23-10...Fla over FSU 21-14. Must mean that, regardless of record, FSU was better than LSU...right? Just kiddin' , SEC guys.

[billybud]

If Notre Dame and LSU were matched...who would you put money on?

Is a two loss LSU a lot worse than 2 loss ND?

ND was beaten by Michigan by 26 points in South Bend and by USC by 20 points...

LSU lost to Aubuen by 4 and Florida by 13...

If ND is deserving than LSU is deserving...the Rose will take one of the two.

[silverfox]

If Notre Dame and LSU were matched...who would you put money on?

LSU by 12

[Spence]

They will probably take Notre Dame based on how the travel and TV ratings and such. Notre Dame has no claim over LSU when comparing the strength of the teams, but the BCS doesn't guarantee that the best teams go after the first two. After the championship game, they are in it for the matchups that provide the most money. They only thing LSU has over Notre Dame in that regard is that Michigan already killed Notre Dame once this year and there isn't any evidence that it wouldn't happen again.

[Spence]

Florida, Arkansas, and LSU all have more claim then Notre Dame, but it won't matter because that isn't the criteria used. The Rose will match the teams that stand to give them the best payday. That is probably Michigan-Notre Dame. Although it could be any of those teams and Notre Dame.

[RazorHawk]

Actually I think only conference champions should be eligible so if Arkansas doesnt beat Fla next week, I don't think they should go BCS either, and vica versa. JMO.

Using the logic that only conference champions be eligible for BCS bowl games, there are not 7 BCS conferences. The only BCS conferences are, I believe Big 10, Big 12, SEC, Pac 10, ACC and Big East.

So to follow that you would have the champions of those conferences plus Notre Dame or two other at large schools from minor conferences to make up the BCS bowl games. They would have to eliminate the extra BCS bowl they added and get back to 4 games instead of 4 plus the championship.

The 8 teams this year would be Ohio St, SEC champ, Big 12 champ, ACC champ, Pac 10 champ, Notre Dame, Boise St plus one of these: BYU(10-2), Ohio(9-3), Central Michigan(8-4), Middle Tenn State(7-5)

Left out would be Michigan, Wisconsin (LSU, Florida, Ark 2 of 3)

I would say that if only conference champions be eligible for BCS bowl games would insure some very weak teams from weak conferences getting in, each year. It would also insure that some very good teams from strong conferences not get in.

I just read my post and it screams "Bring on a true Playoff"!