CollegeFootballPoll.com Message Board

Using computers does not eliminate bias. Someone (a person) had to program the computer to compute the results. How much weight for SOS, and how is that SOS determined. Many factors go into it.

I remember seeing a computer ranking that had a team that was ranked between 15-20, and for this programmer they were ranked #1. I really don't have a problem with a selection committee.

We had a two-team playoff (BCS), now a four-team playoff. I am on the side of going to 16 teams and get it on. Let the bowls fall or survive as they may. My guess is, with a 16 team playoff, there would probably be 10 or 15 bowls survive, using the 20 or 30 teams not in the top 16. No way to know what would happen.

donovan wrote:Let the conferences pick their champions however they do it. If some conference has better teams at lower standings than some that are going. Oh Well....

I think I've seen this some where before? If the Bowl backers want to keep their bowl alive, then incorporate the bowls into the play off system grated this means some teams will likely go to more than one bowl game in a season but it is a way to keep the corporate sponsors happy and make the tournament system work.

warrriorsfan808 wrote:

donovan wrote:Let the conferences pick their champions however they do it. If some conference has better teams at lower standings than some that are going. Oh Well....

I think I've seen this some where before? If the Bowl backers want to keep their bowl alive, then incorporate the bowls into the play off system grated this means some teams will likely go to more than one bowl game in a season but it is a way to keep the corporate sponsors happy and make the tournament system work.

You have...the difference is...I don't give a hoot about playoffs. They are an aberration from, as a whole, the collegiate experience. This ranking everyone and everything, in this country has got to stop. It is symptomatic of a greater issue. What once was touted as inviolate of freedom is now championed as the virtue of the elite. Sports, the great metaphor of political speeches, sermons and message board blogging, leads the way to our chaotic way of life. I see this addiction to chasing being number one in everything, just that, an addiction. And denial is rampant.

donovan wrote:

warrriorsfan808 wrote:

donovan wrote:Let the conferences pick their champions however they do it. If some conference has better teams at lower standings than some that are going. Oh Well....

I think I've seen this some where before? If the Bowl backers want to keep their bowl alive, then incorporate the bowls into the play off system grated this means some teams will likely go to more than one bowl game in a season but it is a way to keep the corporate sponsors happy and make the tournament system work.

You have...the difference is...I don't give a hoot about playoffs. They are an aberration from, as a whole, the collegiate experience. This ranking everyone and everything, in this country has got to stop. It is symptomatic of a greater issue. What once was touted as inviolate of freedom is now championed as the virtue of the elite. Sports, the great metaphor of political speeches, sermons and message board blogging, leads the way to our chaotic way of life. I see this addiction to chasing being number one in everything, just that, an addiction. And denial is rampant.

So are you advocating that we quit keeping score? Just play for the sake of playing. We already do that for some 5-7 year old kids.

I guess, I am just the opposite, the competition to win, is sort of what made this country. Not to be too political, but currently the President is trying to make things more equal for everyone, and take for the do'ers and give to those that do nothing.

RazorHawk wrote:

donovan wrote:

warrriorsfan808 wrote:

donovan wrote:Let the conferences pick their champions however they do it. If some conference has better teams at lower standings than some that are going. Oh Well....

I think I've seen this some where before? If the Bowl backers want to keep their bowl alive, then incorporate the bowls into the play off system grated this means some teams will likely go to more than one bowl game in a season but it is a way to keep the corporate sponsors happy and make the tournament system work.

You have...the difference is...I don't give a hoot about playoffs. They are an aberration from, as a whole, the collegiate experience. This ranking everyone and everything, in this country has got to stop. It is symptomatic of a greater issue. What once was touted as inviolate of freedom is now championed as the virtue of the elite. Sports, the great metaphor of political speeches, sermons and message board blogging, leads the way to our chaotic way of life. I see this addiction to chasing being number one in everything, just that, an addiction. And denial is rampant.

So are you advocating that we quit keeping score? Just play for the sake of playing. We already do that for some 5-7 year old kids.

I guess, I am just the opposite, the competition to win, is sort of what made this country. Not to be too political, but currently the President is trying to make things more equal for everyone, and take for the do'ers and give to those that do nothing.

Absolutely not. What we do is rank everything without any criterion other that...opinion. That is what college football does with this insanity and burn a swath of destruction built on years of tradition.
Of course you keep score when you play a game. You keep the score that counts, on the scoreboard...not a bunch of statistics that is fodder for changing reality. Competition is not what made this country, it was free enterprise which may or may not include competition. We like to bash politics..and I will lead the charge...but that is a reflection of the electorate. We have met the enemy and it is us, Pogo kind of said.

Here's the example. You are a Pro golfer. I am not a good golfer...never was...shot in the 90's, that is about it. So I would play in company sponsors tournaments...and they were all handicapped....what kind of baloney is that...well..it works so everyone can play and win a dozen golf balls with some pharmaceutical' company logo on them. Was it fun, yes.........and the fact with my handicap I won some tournaments never meant that I should play on the Pro Tournament. And that is what we are doing to college football. We are handicapping everything. 35 bowl games so everyone can be a bowler....

We live in a society where people come in and say. My doctor is the best orthopedic surgeon in the Northwest, or on the West Coast or Milky Way Galaxy. And who makes those surveys...no one..people just want to believe they have the best.

So everybody go to a bowl and give them all blue ribbons and deceive ourselves....that is what we do best, deceive ourselves....

I guess reading your post, that is why I am for playoffs, instead of letting computers and media determine the champions. Of course there has to be some of the computers and people to determine who plays, as there is no way in football that you could have a 64 or 128 team playoff.

Many of the states now have 5, 6 or more classes for football, to balance the teams, based on student enrollment. Then they have a 16 team playoff for each division, with sometimes teams that might only have had 2 or 3 wins during the season. Their reward for making the playoffs, might mean a bus ride of a couple hundred miles to play a game that they will more than likely lose by 40 or 50 points.

I guess my whole position is for a playoff, and if a bunch of meaningless bowl games go by the wayside, so be it.

I think we agree on some things and disagree on some. As a golfer, my reading comprehension is not always that good.

RazorHawk wrote:I guess reading your post, that is why I am for playoffs, instead of letting computers and media determine the champions.

With espn having exclusive rights to these playoffs, over its first 12 years; the media will be controlling things.

They already sway opinion with their constant barrage of analysis, and the ever misleading ap poll --- to assume they are going to abandon their current tactics to get what they want, after the Collegiate Association having given in to what the media wants, is simply naive.

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Cane from the Bend wrote:

RazorHawk wrote:I guess reading your post, that is why I am for playoffs, instead of letting computers and media determine the champions.

With espn having exclusive rights to these playoffs, over its first 12 years; the media will be controlling things.

They already sway opinion with their constant barrage of analysis, and the ever misleading ap poll --- to assume they are going to abandon their current tactics to get what they want, after the Collegiate Association having given in to what the media wants, is simply naive.

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So you are saying there will be no expansion of the playoff, because ESPN is making so much money with the bowls?

Razor. I am not for playoffs. Would like a conference bowl between two similar conferences. I absolutely understand people wanting a playoff. I think no matter what we have, we want it to be as fair as possible. I think we probably only disagree on the playoff or no playoff and I am willing to accept my position is not going to happen.

I also get money drives all of this and it is advertisers money based on consumer purchases....so if the consumer wants a playoff...that will happen and the media will design it so to generate as much revenue as possible. Nothing wrong with that.

My ranking points are scattered and unintelligible...I get that. I just don't see the necessity of ranking everything in existence and that has little to do with football.

RazorHawk wrote:

Cane from the Bend wrote:

RazorHawk wrote:I guess reading your post, that is why I am for playoffs, instead of letting computers and media determine the champions.

With espn having exclusive rights to these playoffs, over its first 12 years; the media will be controlling things.

They already sway opinion with their constant barrage of analysis, and the ever misleading ap poll --- to assume they are going to abandon their current tactics to get what they want, after the Collegiate Association having given in to what the media wants, is simply naive.

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So you are saying there will be no expansion of the playoff, because ESPN is making so much money with the bowls?

Just the opposite ...

The playoffs will eventually expand, because the media is paying enough money, that they will get their way.

However, it will be the media's will that is going to drive the playoffs to expand. And the Collegiate Association is going to sell out, and give them everything they want.

One thing they will also do, is start dropping the smaller conferences from the playing field.

Which is a hypocritical move, seeing as how espn used the parity/antitrust angle to force the playoff issue. It was an easier way to get the common viewer on board; and now it'll be the target to cut most of the bowl games, and banish the midmajors from the Division.

The people got on the tournament band wagon, with the charge being led by the media ... now the people are going to get what they asked for --- it just isn't going to be what they wanted.

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I think that the playoffs will eventually get to 16 and max out with 2 layers of games being played to get a conference champion. I also believe that the bowls are going to go the way of the dinosaur. They may use a bowl location to play a round, but these teams that get 8 wins are going to be lucky to get a playoff game and they aren't getting a real post season out of conference. I think there will be 4/20-25 team conferences and 4 of those 20-25 teams in each conference are going to get a post season. with one team from each conference getting to play a team from out side their conference in the post season. I also believe the conferences will be even more top heavy then they are now. The money will be good though, unless the players start getting paid for real. Then I look for half the one hundred teams to fold.

donovan wrote:Razor. I am not for playoffs. Would like a conference bowl between two similar conferences. I absolutely understand people wanting a playoff. I think no matter what we have, we want it to be as fair as possible. I think we probably only disagree on the playoff or no playoff and I am willing to accept my position is not going to happen.

I also get money drives all of this and it is advertisers money based on consumer purchases....so if the consumer wants a playoff...that will happen and the media will design it so to generate as much revenue as possible. Nothing wrong with that.

My ranking points are scattered and unintelligible...I get that. I just don't see the necessity of ranking everything in existence and that has little to do with football.

Half of me likes the idea of going to back to the bowls of the Pre-BCS era. The other half says that if we "want" to "crown" someone; ESPN and a committee made up of various individuals is NOT the way to do it.

This system is only going to ensure that the reputable/historical programs will make it to the big game.

AND to appear unbiased (as all politically driven groups do) every few years they will throw in a team that doesn't deserve it so that team can be dismantled, and that will leave a real contender out.

Kind of like the proverbial dog being thrown a bone.

I think Derek is exactly right about this.

Amen. And Happy New Year....

I vote to go back to the pre BCS era with conferences aligned with bowl tie ins. Makes for split champions sometimes because of the polls but it also makes great arguments for the next 8 months and better memories. I know, know, it isn't gonna happen.